works 93 steering help

The place for all things Yokomo.

Moderators: scr8p, klavy69

Post Reply
rccars4sal
Approved Member
Posts: 1001
Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:05 pm
Location: USA
Been thanked: 1 time

works 93 steering help

Post by rccars4sal »

Hi guys. Im trying to finish a works 93 from scratch. Having trouble with steering. Im using the upgrade carbon fiber steering rack with ball bearing. It adds about 11mm to the length on each side of the steering assembly. So, steering rods are about 11mm shorter using the rack.

Problem. Not enough ackerman! Its like reverse ackerman. There seems to be more angle on the outside of the arc, and less on inside. In running, this will cause terrible scrubbing.

First thing, is I am not using Yokomo steering knuckles. I dont have them. So, its got some Kyosho knuckles that have similar geometry. Not sure if thats the main issue with the ackerman though.

Question: does the longer steering rack actually change ackerman angles? Would it be better to mount the steering rods directly to the servo saver arms, and lengthen the rods? Its also a matter of finding turnbuckle tie rods the correct length. I guess thats not big deal, except I dont have any 11mm longer. Will have to cut some longer ones down.

Anybody with pictures of their 93 works steering set ups please post.

Thanks!

Image

Image

Image

User avatar
jwscab
Super Member
Posts: 6479
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:42 am
Location: Chalfont, PA
Has thanked: 10 times
Been thanked: 434 times

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by jwscab »

the longer rack will affect bump steer, but could also affect perceived ackermann while the suspension is in full droop. You might get better ackermann geometry by moving the outer ball end to the other set of holes closer to the kingpins. this will likely better align your geometry.

the ackermann is defined by the imaginary line drawn through the kingpin through the steering link ball all the way to the rear where the left and right imaginary lines intersect. for true ackermann, they should align with the centerline of the rear axles.

http://www.rctek.com/technical/handling/ackerman_steering_principle.html

Peakey
Approved Member
Posts: 578
Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:55 am
Location: Nottingham, UK
Been thanked: 3 times

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by Peakey »

According to the manual they need to be 73mm if that helps any

http://www.retromodelisme.com/scan_pages/467/super-dogfighter-works-93-yokomo-page-16.html

rccars4sal
Approved Member
Posts: 1001
Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:05 pm
Location: USA
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by rccars4sal »

I switched to the inside hole on the steering knuckle, and got more outside angle, and about the same inside angle. Bump steer is all but non existant with this carbon rack! Ive got a long ball stud at the knuckle and a short non threaded ball stud on the rack, so the angles match very closely between steering rod and A arm,, and I can not see any bump steer.

So, how is it other buggies adjust ackerman? I think on Losi cars the steering bell cranks get angled inward or outward to affect knuckle travel forward and back. Not really possible on this 93,, unless I switch back to wire joiner or perhaps a tierod joiner...

My pics denote max steering travel angles.

rccars4sal
Approved Member
Posts: 1001
Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:05 pm
Location: USA
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by rccars4sal »

O/K, so factory has the steering rods mounted to the saver arms, rather than the rack. Ill try that.

User avatar
jwscab
Super Member
Posts: 6479
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:42 am
Location: Chalfont, PA
Has thanked: 10 times
Been thanked: 434 times

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by jwscab »

yeah i didn't get to reply yesterday, other cars adjust ackermann by moving the inner ball position/tie link around. See the rc10B2 manual at the end for a good description of ackerman changes with bellcrank settings.

rccars4sal
Approved Member
Posts: 1001
Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:05 pm
Location: USA
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by rccars4sal »

Interesting. On the b2 manual, ackerman is changed by repositioning the steering crank joining rod from closer to the crank fulcrum to further out. It appears the angle of the steering cranks stays the same.

No options on the 93 works. Ive got it built and set up as close to factory as possible. Its missing the correct ball studs for the top of the steering cranks, so it has to have screw and nuts, instead of the cute little kingpins and ball studs.... ALOT of special hardware on the 93!

Hinge pins, steering ball studs, camber brace ball stud thing... WHat else?! Is it the 93 that got special 2.1 wheels?

As for the steering, Im tired of messing with it, so its as close to standard as can be under the circumstances,, and I think its sub standard. When some proper knuckels magically appear,, it will get done again. For now,, its a roller.

Peakey
Approved Member
Posts: 578
Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:55 am
Location: Nottingham, UK
Been thanked: 3 times

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by Peakey »

rccars4sal wrote:Interesting. On the b2 manual, ackerman is changed by repositioning the steering crank joining rod from closer to the crank fulcrum to further out. It appears the angle of the steering cranks stays the same.

No options on the 93 works. Ive got it built and set up as close to factory as possible. Its missing the correct ball studs for the top of the steering cranks, so it has to have screw and nuts, instead of the cute little kingpins and ball studs.... ALOT of special hardware on the 93!

Hinge pins, steering ball studs, camber brace ball stud thing... WHat else?! Is it the 93 that got special 2.1 wheels?

As for the steering, Im tired of messing with it, so its as close to standard as can be under the circumstances,, and I think its sub standard. When some proper knuckels magically appear,, it will get done again. For now,, its a roller.
They came with black carbon re enforced 4 hole wheels :lol:

User avatar
jwscab
Super Member
Posts: 6479
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:42 am
Location: Chalfont, PA
Has thanked: 10 times
Been thanked: 434 times

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by jwscab »

effectively, they are altering the arc of travel and length of tie rods.

rccars4sal
Approved Member
Posts: 1001
Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:05 pm
Location: USA
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by rccars4sal »

Image

Image

Image

Peakey
Approved Member
Posts: 578
Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:55 am
Location: Nottingham, UK
Been thanked: 3 times

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by Peakey »

Looks really good but these are the ones I was talking about

Image

rccars4sal
Approved Member
Posts: 1001
Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:05 pm
Location: USA
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by rccars4sal »

Dang. Closest I have are the pink wheels or a set of rough trinity wheels. Oh well, poor car is a mutt anyway.

Peakey
Approved Member
Posts: 578
Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:55 am
Location: Nottingham, UK
Been thanked: 3 times

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by Peakey »

They pop up buddy

zzzubbb
Regular Member
Posts: 22
Joined: Thu May 26, 2016 12:06 pm
Location: Perth, Scotland, UK
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: works 93 steering help

Post by zzzubbb »

Black wheels - 4 hole - i may be able to help..

Also re Akerman, what are those front knuckles you have there, they dont look to be Yokomo. maybe YR4 or more like Kyosho with the reinforcement and kicked out arm.. could they be causing the issue?

Peakey may be able to help you with a picture of a standard works knuckle..

Could be wrong but think they are the same as YZ10 ones.

Z

Post Reply

Create an account or sign in to join the discussion

You need to be a member in order to post a reply

Create an account

Not a member? register to join our community
Members can start their own topics & subscribe to topics
It’s free and only takes a minute

Register

Sign in

  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post
  • 93 Works Steering Post Support
    by alsoli » » in Yokomo Forum
    10 Replies
    1588 Views
    Last post by Peakey
  • Factory Works 180* Steering Bellcrank Build
    by NomadRacer » » in RC10 Buggy Forum
    69 Replies
    8054 Views
    Last post by XLR8
  • B3 steering end point issue - not enough steering lock
    by green510 » » in Temple's RC10 Tech Forum
    1 Replies
    1063 Views
    Last post by RC10th
  • Skunk Works Or Junk Works?
    by FasterLouder » » in Yokomo Forum
    6 Replies
    891 Views
    Last post by NRG
  • T2 steering
    by vintagerc10 » » in RC10 Truck Forum
    8 Replies
    1522 Views
    Last post by Bugle
  • Steering
    by woodall01 » » in RC10 Re-Release Forum
    0 Replies
    1073 Views
    Last post by woodall01
  • need more steering.
    by twisted » » in Temple's RC10 Tech Forum
    9 Replies
    1160 Views
    Last post by yellowdatsun
  • Steering id
    by mikea96 » » in RC10 Buggy Forum
    2 Replies
    688 Views
    Last post by mikea96

Return to “Yokomo Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 14 guests