New Worlds Build and Racer

Everything pertaining to the RC10 re-releases.
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New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by RCveteran »

I have been doing this way too long and always ran Losi. For some reason, I got bored, sold that collection and have gone down the RC10 wormhole. I built this to run at the local carpet off road track that recently opened. I am running Schumacher tires they recommended, foam in rear, no foam stuffed in fronts. I'll use this thread to update changes I make based on results. I'll be practicing this week and hopefully dialing it in. And of course just a pic hanging out with friends, a rere classic and my next EBAY resto car which appears to be all complete and not used much.

Sorry to the painters here, I am not one, so this is what a few hours, a can or two and masking tape yielded. After I bounce it off the walls a few times it won't matter. :D

Also I had read ahead of time about the issues with the rere Stealth transmission. I had them. The thing would barely turn. It was so bad I am not even sure how I would have solved it. So the old style case and idler gear without the bearings inside it and smooth as glass. The topshaft was fine but I had an extra B4 on hand just in case and it was not needed. So whether it was more the case or the idler gear, I don't know.
Worlds Rere.jpg
Worlds rere 2.jpg
Worlds rere 3.jpg
Worlds rere4.jpg
Worlds rere6.jpg

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by lmw94002 »

I like the paint. :)

I've had the airbrush and compressor for like 15yrs... I probably should break it out someday and really learn how to use it.
--
RC10CE 6-gear, RC10 Team, 10L, 10LSS, Worlds, B2, B4 TC, FT TC3, Nitro SC8, SC18, RC18LM, FT SC10.2, Worlds-ReRe, B6, B6D
--Builds--
SSC10 build - http://www.rc10talk.com/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=41740

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by RCveteran »

Hey thanks, I've tried airbrushing with some success, though I just do not enjoy it. It's one of those things that just does not interest me much. I love the mechanical assembly and tuning. Painting not so much, so I have a lot of respect for people who do it well and happy to pay for their talent when I need something special.

And with my awesome driving combined with a few kids with Traxxas Slash battering rams sure to be on track, it will be ruined in no time!

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by OUTLAWD »

RCveteran wrote: Mon Apr 24, 2017 1:57 pm And with my awesome driving combined with a few kids with Traxxas Slash battering rams sure to be on track, it will be ruined in no time!
No kidding! I had a guy do me a favor and try flipping me over with his SCT...of course with my freshly painted body
RC10 WC re-re / SC10.2 / RC10 CE / 2x RC10GT-E / Futaba FX10

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by lmw94002 »

There's the paid-for airbrushed "shelf/show" body... and then my 2-tone (3 if I'm feeling adventurous) rattle can job track body.
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RC10CE 6-gear, RC10 Team, 10L, 10LSS, Worlds, B2, B4 TC, FT TC3, Nitro SC8, SC18, RC18LM, FT SC10.2, Worlds-ReRe, B6, B6D
--Builds--
SSC10 build - http://www.rc10talk.com/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=41740

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by RCveteran »

lmw94002 wrote: Mon Apr 24, 2017 2:23 pm then my 2-tone (3 if I'm feeling adventurous) rattle can job track body.
Funny, as I was thinking of going for third color I thought why even bother, but it was early and the coffee was good so three colors it was. Most of my runner bodies are simply what paint do I have to use up.

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by RCveteran »

First day at the track was ended earlier than planned by a kid with a Traxxas Slash which appeared to have a full size Hemi powering it as he launched blindly off the biggest jump there right into my lane head on, BOOM. Amazingly he hit me dead head on. A few bent steering screws, nose tubes, a arm stretched and not sure what else yet but I will repair. Well I am all for people getting started however they can, my god this thing was a tank with too much power in his hands. I thought about my first hornet as comparison.

Prior to that I ran a lot of batteries through. First time ever on astro turf. Incredible amounts of traction. I was running 17.5T. The biggest issue was not enough steering. The back was hooked up, it was not awful by any means, quite good actually but I need more steering. I was running silver springs front and rear. First change was to stiffen rear a bit by moving collars down. This helped. Then I loaded up front toe out, this really helped. I don't know exact degrees but quite visible. And finally switched to stiffer blue springs in rear with collars all the way back to the top.

This seemed to result in the best I was going to get to today. I actually think I need a more weight on front. I am running shorty lipo as far forward as I can. So need to find more front grip. So much rear bite on this surface. In the end stiffer rear and more front toe out was a far as I got today. The car few perfect off all types of jumps, best flying offroad car I have ever had with really no throttle tricks in the air.

I was very impressed, I am convinced there is no reason it could not be in the thick of it. I turned a few laps with a friend who had RC10B6M running a 10T motor. He clearly had too much power for this size track and pulled in straights, but lap after lap my old buggy could hang. Didn't have a photographer so this is all.

Would a little more looser slipper help to not put so much power down instantly or am I thinking backwards?
Worlds track.jpg
Worlds track 2.jpg

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by FWLBP »

Wow RCvet, what a eventful outing! Sorry to hear about your misfortune. That kid was in way over his head and his "tank" should've been detuned a bit to get him acclimated without flying across lanes. I too understand that people's skills aren't the best when starting out, thats why they shouldn't have a car that can out drive them, hence me starting in spec slash, pretty hard to get a brushed slash to fly across lanes. :lol: Regardless, thanks for posting what experience you did learn. Just driving on the street, I too feel like this car has some serious rear grip! I can pretty much just pin the throttle and it just takes off, very little fishtailing. My 3800kv lcg slash can't do that, it'll spin all day long. I'm not sure if loosing the slipper would be what you want. I'm not a expert here, and am learning still. But from what I've read, I think loosening the diff slightly can give you more steering in corners, maybe give that a try too?

Per this link:
http://www.rccaraction.com/building-and-adjusting-your-ball-diff-featuring-team-associateds-ryan-cavalieri/
Wondering whether to run your diff tighter or looser and how does it affect the handling? Good, you are asking the right questions.

Looser diff- Allows car to rotate easier around corners and will give you more low speed steering. If your car is sliding sideways in corners or you just cant seem to get through the 180’s very good, loosening your diff might be a good idea.

Tighter diff- More forward bite and traction coming out of corners. If your car is spinning out easy under acceleration or going around corners, a tighter diff may be what you’re looking for.

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by RCveteran »

Calling all expert astro turf racers. This car is becoming a dream a to drive. I've had 3 practice days now under my belt and this thing holds it own just fine among the crowd or people having fun.

I have been slowly adjusting one variable at a time and I am almost there. What I need now is still more front traction. Currently you can see just how low I have this thing sitting, that has been the biggest factor to success. The fast guys with the current mid engine wonder cars are about 15mm ride height I am a few mm's higher. This was foreign to me from my old days of real off road tracks.

I have silver soft springs, 30wt shock oil front and back with #2 pistons. Rear shocks inboard top hole far outer hole on a-arms. This change really helped counteract the tendency to want to roll over due to so much grip.

What I need now to go one step further, more front steering bite (2 degrees toe out right now, helped a lot) and if I can find a way less tendency to want to roll over.

In conclusion this thing is a fighter and I am surprising many with it, what would be little tweaks form here to get more front grip. There is so much traction I am not sure one can really get the rear to slide at all with a 17.5T motor I a running. More rotation with less tendency to roll is what I need.

The tires are pretty much the hot Schumacher softs the fast guys are running. Lack of grip is not the problem, too much grip is. How about less rear toe in? I still think the rear will be glued though.

Can you tell me what affect the following ideas I have may have?

1) Move front shocks at top inboard to final hole?
2) Add weight to nose?
3) Heavier shock oil?
4) Shock piston help?
3) Run differential tighter?
4) Other ideas?



Ride height one.jpg
ride height 5.jpg
ride height 4.jpg
ride height 3.jpg
Ride height 2.jpg

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by lmw94002 »

Well stock rear toe is 3 degrees I think. So going to 1.5 or 0 could help. Generally speaking when you can't add more steering, take away rear traction. Stiffer rear spring? Or dial a little / more brake into the car

Do you sauce the tires?
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RC10CE 6-gear, RC10 Team, 10L, 10LSS, Worlds, B2, B4 TC, FT TC3, Nitro SC8, SC18, RC18LM, FT SC10.2, Worlds-ReRe, B6, B6D
--Builds--
SSC10 build - http://www.rc10talk.com/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=41740

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by RCveteran »

When I tried the stiffer blue springs in rear I felt for some reason it wanted to roll over more. It was subtle but there. I do not use sauce. Too much grip really. I have not tried the stiffer springs at this ride height, I will have to try. I was thinking heavier shock oil with these softer springs may help. This is the most I have focused on dialing a car in for some time.

I didn't even think about dialing in brake, I'll have to see what this ESC can do. Less toe is a good idea as well.

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by lmw94002 »

You can dial brake via radio too.

More front traction will increase risk to traction roll.

Did you try tweaking camber on front and/or rear ?

Run a front wing? Or reduce rear wing downforce?

Switch rear tires or maybe change the inserts?
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--Builds--
SSC10 build - http://www.rc10talk.com/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=41740

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by RCveteran »

These are all good ideas and what I needed. I have not messed with Camber. I am using the generally agreed upon fast tire set and foams. But of course this set up is for mostly modern and mid engine at his track. They are very soft Schumacher mini pins with foam in rears. The fronts are wider Schumachers with no foam. Since I am playing for most part I do not have a suitcase of tires to play with. If you were to try one other set I assume I'd want to go harder in rear to reduce grip?

As for camber? More or less front and rear?

I've been trying to adjust not too much at once so these are all good things to play with one at a time. I've never had so much grip like this in my old dirt days so was probably a little more sloppy in my set up. Now with so much grip I am noticing small changes more than I ever did when I made them in past.

In past it would be like ok I changed this and not really sure what it did. With this grip it was much more obvious with each change what happened as a result. I needed more ideas to play with and you have certainly given me some!

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by lmw94002 »

For starters on camber, do the front tires seem to be wearing evenly from the inside to outside of the tire. If not, it means you aren't getting the best contact patch when cornering.

If you can't tell, on old school foam we'd make a chalk stripe across the tire and run a lap or three to see if more if the inside or outside of the mark rubbed off. You could try marker too.

Instead off saucing, even just cleaning fronts and not rears could help. Or try inventive stuff, like once I saw a guy put baby powder on tires to lessen grip...
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RC10CE 6-gear, RC10 Team, 10L, 10LSS, Worlds, B2, B4 TC, FT TC3, Nitro SC8, SC18, RC18LM, FT SC10.2, Worlds-ReRe, B6, B6D
--Builds--
SSC10 build - http://www.rc10talk.com/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=41740

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Re: New Worlds Build and Racer

Post by RC10th »

How is the car traction rolling? Is it rolling over on the front causing it to tip over? Picking up the inside rear tire?

More droop/roll we found actually sometimes reduces the tendency to traction roll. I think the reason is the car rolls beyond the point of traction and actually starts reducing grip.

Those tires may be the hot ticket for the modern buggies but not ideally suited to your car. I think with modern rubber and high grip tracks the RC10 could do with another outside shock hole on the front arms.

As mentioned earlier reducing rear toe will free the back of the car up, also increasing the antisquat will help the car rotate better on power and under brakes/drag brake.

Taking weight off the rear by moving weight forward will help with rotation, incresing the wheel base also does a similar thing.

It's all a balancing act.
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