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Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:13 pm
by scr8p
I stopped in at hobbytown today for a certain part and of course they didn't have it. But they did happen to have some of the jconcept 1/16 e-revo rims and I've wanted a pair of them for awhile now to mess sround with. So here's the direction I went:

Modified hpi super star adapters for losi.
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I then installed a b3 cvd on the right side with stock carriers and flanged 3/16" bearings. 1/4" on the left with a tq style 2" rim.
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Pretty close going by the center of the wheel.

recent thread from sean doing pretty much the same thing with jammin rims and differnt adapter:

http://www.rc10talk.com/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=30218

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 9:52 am
by losiXXXman
With that setup pn your b1.5, you could do JConcepts rulux dyed black up front - that'd be pretty trick right? You get the cool looks of the rulux, without having to go all OIN...(seeing as though that's getting pretty tired now :lol: )

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 9:58 am
by jwscab
looks like a pretty wide wheel. do you have to trim the inner bead off or will a standard buggy tire fit on there?

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:27 am
by JK Racing
I believe those wheels are designed for buggy tires.

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:13 am
by scr8p
The 1/16 trucks use 2.2 buggy tires.

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 7:41 pm
by Orange
I like the one I did because it was a Jay Halsey design. Its kinda fitting that it works so well, :mrgreen:

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 9:13 am
by scr8p
i'm headed out the door for work, so this is a completely lazy post on my parts. meaning....... you guys go do the work and i'll wait for your answers. plenty of other guys do it, why can't i right? :P :lol: :lol:

ok, i haven't looked into it much.... if at all. i'm sure there are different thicknesses of the 12mm hexes for 3/16" axles. anyone feel like compiling a small list of mfg. and the thickness of their hexes?

take your time, i'll wait........ :wink: :lol:

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 9:40 am
by Charlie don't surf
Yeah, no.

Seans got a neat system going, but I can't reveal it...until he does 8)

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 10:25 am
by DMAT
maybe ill figure it out, i was running 1/16 e revo wheels for a short while. The biggest issue was the rims. I was trying to offset them as much as possible in the rear which ended with the nut barely fitting inside the rim and tightening would scrap against the rims. also, with the fronts, it seems like they dont fit 5mm as I had to grind the inside slightly to get them on the axle. The offset they have makes it difficult to avoid hitting the hub carrier. I had b4 parts on the front during that test.

I'm gonna order one but If my measurements are right. a 3/16 x 1/2" bearing will fit in the 12mm hex tightly. I had a 5mm x 12mm in a test setup but it had some wobble to it. I need to measure out a bearing size for the outside of the wheel. Also a note. This was for the front wheels.

until I can get a setup that is straight plug n play. I wont post.

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 11:14 am
by stickboy007
I have tried two approaches for the rear rims.

#1) Original or RPM RC10 rear arms, with B4 rear hub carriers and B44 rear CVAs. You need to shave the B4 rear hub carriers to make it fit in the RC10 arm.

#2) Dynotech rear arms, with RC10GT rear hub carriers and B4 rear CVAs. (RPM also makes a GT rear hub which fits an oversized outer bearing for durability)

I believe both approaches have been discussed in this thread, but I want to consolidate both approaches, and my own experience with both, into a single post.

Technically speaking, both approaches work. The shock mounting holes on the Dynotech arms are positioned a bit differently than the RC10 arms (each hole is between the holes on the RC10 arms), though. So, with approach #2, you may be limited to the middle hole in terms of how far out you can go (at least if you're using big bore springs like I am), which is in between the middle and outer holes on the original arms.

I have found that with approach #1, you will need some downtravel limiters on the shocks to keep the B44 rear CVAs from coming out of the diff outdrives. It is a fairly uncommon occurrence, but it can and does occasionally happen given the enormous amount of droop. I have also found that, with approach #1, the rear is narrower than the front (if you use modern rims, and this is before applying the GT front axles to widen the front, which increases the front-to-rear width offset even further), and so you end up having to use B2/B3 rear rims to get the correct rear width. This is especially the case under full droop, where the rear wheels get pulled inward slightly. With the car at rest, the rear width is closer to the front (with modern rear rims), but still notably different (sorry...I do not have measurements at the moment).

You can still run modern rims if you want, but you will not be able to use the outer shock mounting hole on the arm (the shock will rub against the rim, but this is not the case if you use B2/B3 rear rims) and then you'll need even more downtravel limiters and you may end up compromising jumping performance as you go further inward with the bottom shock mounting hole. The following youtube link is me running my Team Car with a 17.5 motor, with approach #1, and with modern rims all around. I have Losi big bore springs (red front, yellow rear) and AE 30wt oil all around, with the rear shocks mounted in the bottom middle hole on repro RPM RC10 arms. In the front, I did not yet install the GT front axles, as at the time I was still running RPM front steering blocks, which are not inline. As you can see, it worked alright, although it did suffer from on-power push (this was with, I think, 15 deg castor blocks. I have since installed 30 deg blocks which should help address this problem).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7D7wisg67I

With approach #2, you can mount modern rims and the rear width is almost bang-on compared to an "original" setup. I happen to have both a Team Car (modernized) and a World's Car (not modernized) and so I was able to directly compare the two. Putting both cars back-to-back, the rear widths match very nicely. Since the GT rear hub carrier is slightly narrower, from the inside of the inner bearing to the outside of the outer bearing, than the B4 rear hub carrier, you will need one axle shim between the wheel axle and the inside bearing to eliminate slop between the drive pin and the axle spacer on the outside (this also pushes the dogbone into the diff outdrive a little bit, giving you a little more margin to keep the dogbone from popping out of the diff outdrive). One thing I did notice here is that, with approach #2, you cannot crank on the wheel nut to tighten the wheel down, as this will induce bind in the drivetrain. So you have to start by tightening the nut and then gradually backing off, while turning the wheel to check for resistance, until it rotates freely. This is not an issue, or as significant an issue, for approach #1, but so far as I can tell, this is the only real downside to approach #2.

At the front, I recently installed inline steering blocks with RC10GT axles (which have some offset, as discussed earlier in this thread). If you do this and install modern front rims, the front actually ends up being a little wider than the "original" front width. I think this is because the difference in wheel offset between vintage front rims and modern front rims is smaller than the offset provided by the GT front axles. So now the front ends up being wider than the rear by ~ 1/16". Presently I am running this setup and will test it on one of my local tracks in time (hard to find the right opportunity when I'm always running my B4.1 and B44 on the weekends). I did run this a little bit in my driveway with some beater tires and it felt pretty nice.

Theoretically speaking, I think approach #2 would be preferable, because the Dynotech arms are wider and this should reduce camber gain compared the original arms. Even though the GT rear hubs "reset" the rear width back to parity with the original rear width, the amount by which the hub offsets the wheel location, for the same camber link location, will not affect camber gain, and so you should be better off running a wider arm with smaller offset hubs (which increases the camber link length), as in approach #2. The only disadvantage here is that the GT rear hub carriers have one ballstud mounting hole for the camberlink, whether you use the AE part or the RPM part. So, your camber gain adjustability is not the same as if you used approach #1, where the B4 hub has three mounting hole positions. In most cases, it is probably not an issue, but on loamy, low grip tracks, you may want to revert to approach #1 to get a little more rear side bite.

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Sat Aug 10, 2013 11:20 pm
by chophead69
on my graphite I have the rpm rear arms and the b4 hubs with the b44 cva's I found the axle would hit the inside of the out drive at the top of full travel.I was told to ream the bearing hole deeper so to bearing would sit further in so I could get full upward travel.now I am using b4 shocks but I am also using the rc carbon work shock tower but now I found I need to put shock limiters in so I can get the car to sit level.or if I put the stock shock tower back on it sit better..anyideas? and did anyone have the same issue with the cva's hitting?

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 11:43 pm
by stickboy007
Is this with the 6-gear transmission or the 3-gear Stealth? The 6-gear should be wider, I think, and this can lead to your problem. If you're running the Stealth gearbox, then I don't know. On my Team Car, I have a Worlds rear shock tower and original shocks. Using the original arm + B4 hub setup, with B44 rear CVAs, I have the opposite problem --> too much droop and the dogbones pop out.

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Tue Aug 13, 2013 7:03 pm
by chophead69
its a stealth.I am using rpm team car rear arms.b4 rear hubs,b44 cva's,b4 shocks,rc carbon works b4 shock tower for the rc10.

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:59 pm
by stickboy007
Ok, this is a really dumb question, but are you absolutely positive that they are B44 CVAs? The B4 CVAs look very similar in length, and it is not until you put them side by side that you see the B4 CVAs are just a little bit longer on the dogbone. Also, are you sure that you have no shims between the wheel axle and the inner bearing? Are you sure that the thrust bearing is installed correctly (screw goes in from the right hand side and locks into the plastic unit on the left hand side)?

If these things check out, then I don't know what to say, since I haven't had this type of problem with that setup.

Re: *Parts needed to run modern 2.2 rims/tires on your rc10*

Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 9:35 am
by foots
stickboy007 wrote:Ok, this is a really dumb question, but are you absolutely positive that they are B44 CVAs? The B4 CVAs look very similar in length, and it is not until you put them side by side that you see the B4 CVAs are just a little bit longer on the dogbone. Also, are you sure that you have no shims between the wheel axle and the inner bearing? Are you sure that the thrust bearing is installed correctly (screw goes in from the right hand side and locks into the plastic unit on the left hand side)?

If these things check out, then I don't know what to say, since I haven't had this type of problem with that setup.
Are you running long or short wheelbase with the rear arm mounts?