I am posting it up here as it disappeared from the rc10.com site
Converting Your RC10DS to Accept Standard Touring Car Wheels & Tires
Other Conversion Ideas
INTRODUCTION
After some basic experimentation I have found a way to install standard hex drive touring car wheels onto the RC10DS/NDS as well as the newer DS Qualifier/NDS Qualifier kits. I tried to limit myself to over the counter parts with as little actual grinding or changes to the parts as possible to make it easy to replace parts. The modifications that are required can be done with just about any tools, the only factor being how long this may take.
Since I first came up with this idea and worked on the conversion Associated has now allowed me to include this information on their web site so more people will have access to the information.
The following information should be enough information for the average modeler to do the modifications on their own. Both Associated and myself would love any feedback concerning the modifications to allow the DS/NDS to use Touring Car wheels/tires and bodies. This includes additional ideas or parts. Just remember that for the web site we want the changes to be something that everyone can do, so the use of over the counter parts and minimal modifications (that can be done by anyone) are the main ideas we will follow.
Topper K.
PARTS YOU WILL NEED
This is a list of the parts required, and estimated prices:
vendor part qty cost
- HPI #6120 Super star rear wheel adapter set. 2 sets, $2.00 ea. $4.00
- (any) Standard hex drive wheels (I used Pro-Line wheels) 2 pair
- Associated #6466 Rear shock downstops 2 packages, $1.50 ea $3.00
- Associated #7211 Kingpin ballstud 1 package $4.00
- Associated #7210 B3/T3 30 deg. Caster block 1 package $3.00
- Associated #7230 Ball cups 1 package $5.00
- Associated #8425 Kingpin shims 1 $1.00
- (hobby shop) 5mm X 8mm metric unflanged ball bearings requires 4, $3.95 ea. $15.80
- Traxxas #3636 Steering block pair, $2.99 ea. $2.99
- Traxxas #3637 Front axle pair $2.99
- Traxxas #1654 Stub axle pins pair $2.00
- (hobby shop) 4mm Axle locknuts 2 $1.00 estimated
- (hobby shop) 5mm Axle shims (about .005" thick) $1.00 estimated
STEP BY STEP INSTRUCTIONS
Feel free to print out entire file for your workbench.
Step 1: The changes for the rear axle are very simple. On this parts tree you will find several wheel adapters. The one we will want has a 3/16" center hole with a slot on the back for a 1/16" roll pin. The larger diameter (at the slotted end) will be round, the center will be hex shaped and the outer portion will be a smaller round area again. This part will fit directly onto the DS rear axle. We will need to remove the smaller round portion from the front of the part until the hex portion becomes the outer surface. Slide the adapter on over the roll pin. You can now install the rear wheel and secure it with the standard rear axle nut. This is all that is required to be able to install the rear touring wheel. It will work with standard, narrow, and super narrow wheels. There is no change in the car's rear track width because the tires and wheels change width only on the inside, not the outside.
Step 2: I do recommend some minor suspension changes to all the shocks. I installed .125" (1/8") travel limiters in the shocks. Most of the surfaces I will race on are not real rough. I have just found that this really helps to reduce the body roll. Less body roll means the car does not unload the inside tire and activate the diff reducing performance and increasing wear on the diff parts. I suggest using somewhere between 1/16" and 1/8" travel limiters depending upon the track. I use Associated silver springs #6496 or modified truck springs that are stiffer depending upon my needs. I also run between 30 and 40 weight oil with either #1 or #2 pistons most of the time.
Step 3: Now we start on the front end. We begin by modifying the new T3 caster block. There is a right and a left caster block so we want to make sure we have them lined up correctly so we will make the modifications correctly. The bottom of the caster block has a horizontal hole through where we will mount the outer hinge pin. At the front of the caster block at the bottom hole there is a small area in front of the leading vertical edge. We will need to grind or file about .090" from this area. Be sure to install the steering block on the arm and check that it can move freely and will not bind on the arm during suspension travel or camber changes. This makes the caster block narrower than the opening in the front suspension arm. We will take up the difference with one 1/32" and 1/16" spacers from a #6466 parts package. This will be one small and one medium spacer. This modification is requires due to the coming axle changes. The new axle will be a trailing axle design and without this change the outside standard width wheel will hit the front suspension arm and bind when turned fully. This will move the axle forward to make up for it position change in the new steering block.
Step 4: We will now need to make some minor changes to the Traxxas steering block. First we are going to drill out the vertical hole where we will install our #7211 kingpin. This kingpin is .125" (1/8") in diameter. I drilled my hole out using a standard 1/8" drill bit then went back and reamed out the hole with my .126" straight reaming bit. Take your time and make sure you have the hole straight of the cars front end geometry will be a problem and handling will be inconsistent. Also I have on occasion run into an axle binding problem after in install the kingpin. What I found was that drilling out the kingpin pin hole will sometimes push material into the opening between the bearings where the axle goes through. This can some times rub on the axle so that it will not spin freely. Some trimming may be necessary in this area to correct this problem if it occurs.
Since this is a ballstud kingpin design I try and make the steering block pivot on the kingpin instead of having the kingpin pivot as we normally do on Associated cars. Next we need to determine which end will be the top of each steering block. Measure the opening in the caster block where the steering block will fit. We will now need to trim the top and bottom boss (of the steering block) so that it will fit into the caster block. You may need to remove about .025" more from the top boss than the bottom boss. This is done to move the steering block up so that it will clear the material around the lower hinge pin when the wheel is turned. Take your time and get this right then make sure that there is no binding. We will have to do some chamfering of the caster block to get sufficient turning but we will wait until we have the front axle installed before we start on this. If needed you have #8425 shims to get the spacing correct if there is not enough material to get every thing where you want it.
Step 5: Now we can install the new bearings into the steering block. After we have the bearings installed we can slide in the axle. The traxxas axle is just a headed pin which has been drilled and threaded on the end. This means the axle pins do not fit snugly so they will keep falling out constantly. You will have to deal with the problem until we have everything fitting correctly before we can do something to help with this problem. Normally the axle will have excessive end play and you will need to install shims onto the axle between the outer bearing and the axle pin to correct this problem. Do not worry about this until we have all the parts fitting together correctly.
Step 6: Now we can take our second set of #6120 wheel adapters and make the same modifications to the same adapters we used for the rear wheels. Now we also have to drill out the center hole of the wheel adapter because the front axle is now 5mm and not 3/16". 5mm measures out to .197" so unless you have number drill sizes to get closer you will have to use a 13/64" drill bit which is .203" or six thousands larger in diameter. While you have this drill be installed go ahead and drill out the center hole of the wheels (if needed) with this same size bit. The Pro-Line wheels I used had a smaller center hole that would not fit over the 5mm axle freely. By making this change to all four wheels you can interchange wheels without having to worry about making one set for the front and one set for the rear. The final modification needed for the front wheel hex adapters is to trim the edges of the roll pin slot on the back (of the adapter) at an angle so that it will fit over the larger metric axle pin. Now we can make the final fit adjustments needed.
Step 7: We now need to check all the final fit areas to make sure everything will go together correctly. First install the axle pin, the hex wheel adapter the wheel and the locknut onto the front axle. Is there is excessive end play? If there is you will need to add 5mm axle shims to correct this. We want to take out as much end play as possible but not so much that the parts start binding up. Now we need to file the headed end of the axle to about half the starting height of the axle head. This will help to increase the amount of steering you get. Next you need to trim away some of the back of the caster block at an angle so the steering block will again be able to turn more. I try not to take away more than about half of the material thickness so I do not weaken the part excessively.
Step 8: We can now begin final assembly. First replace the outer #6274 plastic ball cup (of the camber turnbuckle) with the new #7230 longer plastic ball cup This makes up for the difference in length of the camber rod without having to get or make new turnbuckles. Now mount the caster block to the front arm outer hinge pin. Make sure you have the new shims to the rear and the caster block to the front of the arm. Install the ballstud onto the new steering block making sure you have the correct side up on the steering block. Mount the steering block to the caster block using the #7211 kingpin ballstud. The kingpin is longer than needed so install spacers or shims under the caster block to take up the space between the caster block and e-clip. Go ahead and snap on the camber link ball cup and the steering ball cup. Now you can install the new front axle, axle shims (if needed), hex wheel adapter, wheel and axle nut. Once you know you have everything working correctly you can remove the front wheel and hex adapter and secure the axle pin with a small amount of silicone sealant so that it will not slide out every time you have to remove the front wheel adapter. Now set your toe-in and camber and try it out.
Good luck and good racing!!
OTHER CONVERSIONS
I am writing about the RC10 Electric DS Qualifier. I have found an easier way for people to make it possible to use HPI's on their cars, but it is only a good idea if you have foam tires. What you do when the foam is worn off is cut the center out of the entire rim and sand the spokes off until it fits. The side that sticks out the farthest when on the car must be sanded or ground off and then you can make the center in to a hex piece so that it will fit into HPI's hex in the center of their wheel.
I did the Touring Car Wheel conversion per the instructions. The only thing I had problems with was getting the steering to work correctly. I had to switch the ballstud from the top of the spindle to the bottom to get good steering and not be binding the tie rods. I also had to change what I used as king pin rods. I used the original tie rods for them, and got a second pair of factory tie rods to use as tie rods. I also switched what I used as the ball cups. I went with the RPM versions for the added strength and reliability. Along with the wheel conversion, I bought the RPM Zero Degree adapters for a GT, to use on the back suspension and got rid of the toe in. Yes, it's a little wild to drive at first, but if you have driven any of the old 12E's or 12I's, it's no different. I hope this will help out any other future conversions anyone does.
My dad converted 2 of our Dual Sports to regular sedan wheels using HPI uprights, C-hubs and axles from the RS4 Pro. This setup works great and is much better than the Traxxas conversion you show on your website.
We have developed a Traxxas based conversion using Traxxas and RPM items which assembles easily and also works well. Parts required are RPM8125 (x2), TRA3636, TRA2754, TRA3632, TRA3637, Losi A-9708 (use only the RPM adapters for the REAR of the Street Weapon, hence the need for two sets).
