Why waste the money on the fees?

[Eau Rouge]

I have a simple question, and I've heard y'all talk, what makes old RC10 stuff worth so much more than that Falcon.

Simple. Quality then. Quality still. The Tamiyaphiles will pay astronomical amounts for stuff, but that doesn't make them better kits.

I don't mean to be this way, but really, it's all vintage, and it's all garbage really. If it was that great, guess what? The current RC10 would look just like the one from 1986.

Garbage, huh? Then why bother, right?

Unless you haven't seen a current RC10, you should know that other than the 4 wheels and tires, they are nothing alike. And without that early gold tub RC10 from 1983, off road racing today isn't close to what it is. I can show you an original gold tub photographed next to my relatively new B4, if you like.

Thanks to the sell out to Thunder Tiger, this is what has happened. Prices through the roof, because it's now "collectable" And the new stuff is going to be garbage, just like the old days. Associated/ TT is going to go into the same realm as Radio Shack toys.

Hardly. Thunder Tiger has NOTHING to do with the popularity of the original RC cars or the popularity with the RC10, in general. Technology at the time in the 80s was limited as the hobby was still relatively young, and the RC10 was light years ahead of anything else made at the time, and then the Losis did the same after that. Calling the old cars garbage gives no credit to what those designs and ideas did for current technology. The cars we are discussing and collecting are 20 years old and OLDER, and deserve as much or more respect than they currently get. Just about every buggy out there today owes something to the heritage of early Tamiyas and the Associated RC10.

Sour grapes and pissy attitudes will get you nowhere here. You're talking to a wall and will be quickly ignored and discounted with that type of attitude.

[keithc6]

MA you need to do a body like this one............LOL

[scollins]

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2007 6:32 am Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Whiskers wrote-

"I don't mean to be this way, but really, it's all vintage, and it's all garbage really. If it was that great, guess what? The current RC10 would look just like the one from 1986."

"I was involved with rc stuff from about 1988 until 1994. I've been through all the RC10 conversions that y'all pant over, and they were all garbage other than the RPM "Worlds" conversion for the tub chassis. Even the sponsored drivers I new at the time thought it was cool."



Dude, I know you mentioned you had or were having a bad day...but I sense that you were more interested in getting attention as a new member and the story about the bad day was a smokescreen. Please understand 99percent of the guys on here are extremely knowledgeable about the RC hobby overall and especially RC10 related material. Most of us grew up with RC as a major hobby and respect the designs of yesterday simply because we loved um' as kids and the new stuff today owes much of the credit back to some of the vintage designs we all "pant over". Y'all know what I mean?

The negative attitude will definitely not win you any friends here, I can guarantee you that. Be cool like Fonzy , OK?

[MelvinsArmy]

MA you need to do a body like this one............LOL

Oh yes, my old Tremor. Keith, I'm seriously thinking about it. I think that was a good combo.

[FlyinGN]

+1..
I happen to feel that old gold tub cars are superior to todays cars... Ill but a properly set up gold tub against anything today (with the same electronics) and Ill bet it will be a lot closer then you think... The gold tubs are still the standard..

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2007 6:32 am Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Whiskers wrote-

"I don't mean to be this way, but really, it's all vintage, and it's all garbage really. If it was that great, guess what? The current RC10 would look just like the one from 1986."

"I was involved with rc stuff from about 1988 until 1994. I've been through all the RC10 conversions that y'all pant over, and they were all garbage other than the RPM "Worlds" conversion for the tub chassis. Even the sponsored drivers I new at the time thought it was cool."



Dude, I know you mentioned you had or were having a bad day...but I sense that you were more interested in getting attention as a new member and the story about the bad day was a smokescreen. Please understand 99percent of the guys on here are extremely knowledgeable about the RC hobby overall and especially RC10 related material. Most of us grew up with RC as a major hobby and respect the designs of yesterday simply because we loved um' as kids and the new stuff today owes much of the credit back to some of the vintage designs we all "pant over". Y'all know what I mean?

The negative attitude will definitely not win you any friends here, I can guarantee you that. Be cool like Fonzy , OK?

[MelvinsArmy]

I have a simple question, and I've heard y'all talk, what makes old RC10 stuff worth so much more than that Falcon.

I don't mean to be this way, but really, it's all vintage, and it's all garbage really. If it was that great, guess what? The current RC10 would look just like the one from 1986.

I was involved with rc stuff from about 1988 until 1994. I've been through all the RC10 conversions that y'all pant over, and they were all garbage other than the RPM "Worlds" conversion for the tub chassis. Even the sponsored drivers I new at the time thought it was cool.

Thanks to the sell out to Thunder Tiger, this is what has happened. Prices through the roof, because it's now "collectable" And the new stuff is going to be garbage, just like the old days. Associated/ TT is going to go into the same realm as Radio Shack toys.

I'm not really this way all the time, just the search for parts to keep my 2 vehicles running, and maybe build another 2 out of spare parts, has gotten on my nerves, and I'm in a bad mood tonight.

Hmm, where to begin. Well, since you are a newb to the forum, and since I'm a mod, and I should hold my tounge as I am kind of responsible for this place, I'll go easy on you. This time.

Do you really think a 20 year old car, no matter how great could possibly be competitive today? Do you think a 1986 Ferrari Testarossa could hold it's own against an Enzo? And if not, does that make the older car garbage? What about a 1955 Testarossa? That's practically a dinosaur, but it's worth about the same price as 10 Enzos.

How were all the RC10 versions garbage? Where were you racing? From 1984 until TODAY RC10's have dominated or at least been front runners in the 2wd off road class. The only real competition has been from Kyosho (very short lived with the original Ultima) and from Losi. Okay, throw in a Schumacher or other small company now and then, but the only real threat to AE EVER is/was Losi. What are you talking about?

Thunder Tiger has nothing to do with the recent popularity of vintage RC10's. Vintage Tamiyas have been popular for years, now it's time for RC10's. I've been pretty hardcore in to them for about 7 years now. Prices aren't that bad compared to vintage Tamiyas, heck new built RC10's are barely worth more than they sold for new, and we've got 20 years of inflation on top of that. As far as collectibles, it's simple. People are in to something at one point in their life, then get out (usually) then become nostalgic 20 or so years later. Look at the vintage muscle car boom of the late 1980's, early 90's, and it's still going strong. Vintage BMX is the same way.

[FlyinGN]

+1..
I happen to feel that old gold tub cars are superior to todays cars... Ill bet a properly set up gold tub against anything today (with the same electronics) and Ill bet it will be a lot closer then you think... The gold tubs are still the standard..

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2007 6:32 am Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Whiskers wrote-

"I don't mean to be this way, but really, it's all vintage, and it's all garbage really. If it was that great, guess what? The current RC10 would look just like the one from 1986."

"I was involved with rc stuff from about 1988 until 1994. I've been through all the RC10 conversions that y'all pant over, and they were all garbage other than the RPM "Worlds" conversion for the tub chassis. Even the sponsored drivers I new at the time thought it was cool."



Dude, I know you mentioned you had or were having a bad day...but I sense that you were more interested in getting attention as a new member and the story about the bad day was a smokescreen. Please understand 99percent of the guys on here are extremely knowledgeable about the RC hobby overall and especially RC10 related material. Most of us grew up with RC as a major hobby and respect the designs of yesterday simply because we loved um' as kids and the new stuff today owes much of the credit back to some of the vintage designs we all "pant over". Y'all know what I mean?

The negative attitude will definitely not win you any friends here, I can guarantee you that. Be cool like Fonzy , OK?

[Tadracket]

I don't know fly. My nephew bought a B3 a few weeks ago and the car is much lighter and roles smoother than my 6 gear machines. My money is on the new tech but my money is spent on the old tech.

[FlyinGN]

the big changes are in todays electronics.. Other then that the cars are too close.. A stealth trans rolls smooth as silk..

[MelvinsArmy]

Yep. EVERY current 2wd race buggy owes it's existance and major design features to the Stealth equipped RC10. Period.

It's kinda like archeology or evolution in the natural world, only easier because we're talking about roughly 30 years of recent history. I'm saying it's a straight line from today back to 1984, there are no missing links or strange branches. The RC world took a huge leap forward when the RC10 was introduced, and another huge leap when the Stealth was introduced. Yeah, that Wolds RPM thing was cool, no doubt. But, a skilled driver could win just as easily with an AE Stealth tranny wearing bone stock car properly set up. Kinwald did it several years after that holy grail disapeared. Ever wonder why AE never put that car in to production???? Because what existed already was a better all around car. That's why.

Holding my tongue is getting harder to do.

[Tadracket]

Speak the word Army. A held tongue only salivates in the hand of the holder.
Do you want that under your nails?

[scollins]

All,
I concur with the guys here above. You cant ignore the past in terms of where racing is today with the design of these buggies. I am a designer in Detroit doing full size cars and the same rules still apply. No matter what scale the car is we are talking about, the old vintage items will usually hold a high historical value AND high sentimental value.

Our good memories of the past will always fuel us to spend cash on vintage stuff full-size or scale models, this point cannot be underestimated.


Lets go easy on Whiskers here as the site admin stated. Everybody gets vocal once and a while for the wrong reasons....

- But if Whiskers slams the vintage stuff and the guys that cherish it one more time, he may be pretty lonely surfing RC10 talk- Just my humble opinion, as we have plenty of negativity all around us in the media, we dont need any more.

[Ron Jeremy]

Ever wonder why AE never put that car in to production???? Because what existed already was a better all around car. That's why.

While I am quoting one specific example, I really intend to reply to anyone who honestly believes that 15 or 20 year old RC cars are just as good as today's cars.
Please bear with me while I speak frankly: you are crazy.
I am not sure in which regard you are speaking, such as raw performance, durability, style, ease of maintenance... or whatever (and perhaps each of you think of "better" in a different way).
If you look at each of the few random attributes I just listed, individually, you can find compelling, if not outright damning evidence that these old RC10s we love so much are inferior.
In terms of pure performance there isn't even a debate. It is seriously crazy talk to say that any version of the original RC10 can outperform a current RC10.
I raced everything from a team version of the CE car to the B3. I can say with certainty that the B3 is easier to drive faster, easier to work on, as durable, and maybe even "sexier" than the original RC10 (obviously a matter of pure opinion here). The B3 has better tolerances, is far more sophisticated in regards to parts count and design efficiency, is more stable, requires less tuning, and has a base setup that will work in a wider variety of conditions.

I type all that and still take nothing from the vintage stuff. It has its appeal to each of us for one reason or another. I think earlier we contributed our reasons. They ranged from opinions like the one I quoted (which I almost commented on at that time) to my reason: primarily memory lane stuff with a touch of collectoritis (haha, I just made that up). I truly enjoy the vintage RC10's, but I am far from the opinion that some conspiracy has kept them from returning from the dead and winning another IFMAR Worlds.

I do agree on the racing lineage and heritage of the RC10. Some would argue that modern RC has more influence from other cars than MelvinsArmy allowed, and I would tend to agree. Although my direct experience does not go back that far (1984).

Thanks for reading

[Ron Jeremy]

...and I applaud scollins' post just before mine.

[badhoopty]

i dont think whiskers meant at all to irk all you guys.

sounds to me like he's just a little peeved about tryin' to score parts. i've been there myself, and i'm sure there will come a day when i cant afford to compete with richer people who want the same stuff i do.

anyway, my opinions mirror those of all you who posted already so i really aint got anything else to say.