RC10 modern racer build

[m_vice]

great stuff Jeff, thanks for this.

[flipwils11]

Thanks for doing this, Jeff. Now off to order some parts!

[JHarris]

Nice walkthrough, thanks very much! Now to find my blue anodized pan...oh crap! That's right, I don't have one! Have to apply this to a black one I have waiting.

You may not have a blue chassis now, but you could. I talked to my cousin today about this build and a price if someone wanted to duplicate the ano and chrome. He is willing to anodize a chassis set with rear carriers (one color only)and chrome 4 shock bodies with nose tubes for $50/vehicle. Yes, it's more than most want to spend but if someone wants to do it, PM me for his info.

[motomike]

Thank you for sharing this build with us in such great detail! I have been following your vintage racing thread too and I always look forward to your reports.
The question I have for you, and maybe Ruffy could comment on this too, how do these cars drive compared to your team and worlds cars that you raced in the 90's?

[JHarris]

That's difficult to answer simply because it's apples and oranges. I commented to my dad once about how great my car drove and how I never had a car that drove like these back in the day. My dad doesn't say much so when he does speak I try to pay attention since it's usually fairly wise. His response, "we didn't have tracks like this". It got me thinking- he's right. It's hard to compare the cars of back then with where we are now since we used to race on knobby tires in the dirt. Now we race on orange concrete that occasionally gets dusty with tires that hardly resemble an off road spiked tire. So, here's a comparison that I CAN make. My cars drive as good as my B4, they're faster than the modern cars in the superstock class and running a 13.5 were only 4 seconds off the TQ for 2wd modified at our last race. When you consider that the modified TQ was one of my kids (both factory drivers) with the other qualifying second combined with the fact that it was their own RC10's that were just seconds slower; it doesn't get more apples to apples than that. So, if you accept that the cars have naturally progressed over the years and then apply the results of my cars against the modern cars you could conclude that they drive better than the cars of yesterday. Polluting that theory would be Ruffy's car that is exactly how he ran it at the 93 worlds. His car performs just as good as ours and the B4. In fact, he prefers driving his RC10 over his B4. It makes me wonder, did we all jump on the marketing bandwagon and fall prey to the "newer is better" theory or is the new generation legitimately better. You decide....

I don't want to speak for Ruffy so hopefully he will chime in on the topic.

[Charlie don't surf]

I think that we all ditched old racing gear for the newer gear for exactly that reason BITD, but I really thin the main improvements today is tire technology
over everything else.

[scr8p]

but I really thin the main improvements today is tire technology
over everything else.

x2.

[Ruffy]

I couldn't agree more with what has been said here at the bottom in the last few posts. Having run both, I can say that yes the B4 has fantastic qualities that I like, would I say it was a lot better on a smooth hard packed track over the old school RC10, I would say if anything, not by much at all.
Tire technology and track surface technology are the biggest improvements since I last raced for Asssociated (also the Lipos!). Tracks nowdays are mainly very smooth, hard packed and have so much bite that you can run worn tires and get good traction (we traction roll here a lot)... try that back on the old school tracks and you might not make it off of the 1st lap at a race.
The current B4 is a better car; it is a much better, well made car that can be easily built correctly and setup by most anyone thanks to the hard work by the guys at Associated that have made it what it is and provided everyone with a basic setup that will work fairly well on over 90% of tracks. This gives everyone a good starting point. The B4 also has a better slipper and tranny ratio.
Having both cars that run well, but are still not fine tuned for our indoor yet; I do prefer the feel and feedback I get from my old Team car over the B4. There's just something about a well setup team or world's car that makes it a dream to drive. The amount of steering is impressive on it. Where my Team car is lacking, is that I am still running the old speed controller and brushed motors. This is very noticeable after running the new LRP SXX and 9.5 X12 Motor by LRP in my B4. There's a huge difference in acceleration, smoothness and braking with the new electronics. Especially the brakes!
To sum it up, both cars are fantastic to drive and tune. There seems to be less mystery with the newer car setups due to a wealth of information and the well thought out kit and instructions made by Associated than there used to be, the B4 just works well right out of the box. Tires and tracks have changed quite a bit between the era of either car, with the electronics as a whole adding a lot more for a lot less hassle and work. But cars alone, this old man still loves to drive his RC10 Team Car with an old Novak HPC, Airtronics CS2P radio and brushed motors more than my B4.


This is a great thread Jeff, good job buddy!

[vintage AE]

some very good comparisons, just a minor addition... threaded shock bodies have certainly made it easier on tweaking the suspension. Put the newer shocks on an old car if you are going to race it

[JHarris]

Yes, the threaded shocks are a must. (at least for me) I got hooked on them in 1986 when I started running the Brimod's from across the pond. I wish I could find another set. They were not only threaded, but had an aluminum cap with a bleeder. The pic isn't the best, but if you look close enough at my original blue car from '86-'87 you can see the shocks enough to make out what I'm talking about.

[motomike]

Thanks for the replies! I still love racing my old worlds car and it still holds it's own against the b4's and rb5's! I am running a setup that is similar to Ruffy's (19 turn brushed with lipos with modern tires) and I just love it! The thing I like best about this build is that you are using the b4 wheels that are readily available and at the same time you are keeping the stock (or at least stock dimension) suspension arms that keep these buggies looking like the team cars of the 90's!

[Ruffy]

, I'm still using 1990's Assoc. wheels and 1990's Proline tires on my RC10 Team car for racing. The only modern thing Im using is a Lipo battery, but I have also wired up two of my NiCad packs for practice.

I am running modern everything on my B4 car though; (except the radio, receiver and servo, it is still a CS2P Airtronics, Airtronics 92237 receiver and Airtronics 94737 servo).

[JHarris]

Thanks for the replies! I still love racing my old worlds car and it still holds it's own against the b4's and rb5's! I am running a setup that is similar to Ruffy's (19 turn brushed with lipos with modern tires) and I just love it! The thing I like best about this build is that you are using the b4 wheels that are readily available and at the same time you are keeping the stock (or at least stock dimension) suspension arms that keep these buggies looking like the team cars of the 90's!

The front arms are stock. I only changed the rear because the RPM allows dirt to escape. There is a way to run the stock rear arms without them retaining too much dirt. If I have a set of stock arms I will do the standard team mod to them and post a pic later in the week. With the dusty concrete we run on these days stock arms would work just fine.

I have a set of used TQ20's (popular beginning in 1988) that I may bolt on just to demonstrate the difference in tires then and now. If I can find a set of Holiday Buggy tires I'll try those as well. Of course I would video any such testing to share the results.

[DerbyDan]

Great build-up thread Jeff, loving that picture of your old 86/87 car - check out those lightening holes!!

I also like the fact that your new-old build doesn't move away too far from the original team/worlds RC10 configuration - just the longer front shocks & rear hubs are really the only minor geometry changes

As for the old Vs the new buggies thing... I think the modern cars are a little more refined & easier to drive + set-up. Most of our tracks over on this side of the pond seem to now be laid on Astroturf with many man-made features (jumps etc) The tracks seem to develop lots of ruts & undulations that really unsettle the cars.... the ramps/table tops etc seem to be bigger & more prolific than they used to be when I last raced. Over this sort of terrain I think there is an advantage with the modern cars, their wider track & longer suspension arms making them easier & more consistant over the race duration.

That said I do think the move towards Brushless & LiPo technology has closed the gap between the old & new cars - suddenly you can buy more power than you need, making any weight savings & effeciency advances over the last decade or so worthless.

Not sure about any advances in tyre technology - certainly in the last ten years or so, not much has changed, I have a box of (mostly new) tyres left over from when I raced for Schumacher - most of these are what people seem to be still using now.

[markt311]

I'm going to be shortening a set of B44 CVA's this week so I won't have to ream out my hub carriers. They probably won't look as clean as Kinwald's in this shot but I think they'll do the trick! http://www.xfactoryrc.com/rc/Galleries/2009ShootOutDirt/2009SO_DirtCars12.jpg